Sir Mary goes Media: "It's been on our minds for a long time"

m&k: Vanessa, Katharina, Fabian - you have announced that you are starting with Sir Mary Media a specialized branch of your agency. To put it bluntly: Why ... and why now?

Vanessa Habisreutinger To be honest, it's been on our minds for a long time. In recent years, we have been able to win top-class media accounts such as Ovo and Twint and continuously expand our offering. We want to meet the growing demand for our media expertise with an independent offering: the launch of Sir Mary Media is the next logical step for us. Also because we see a vacuum in the market in this area - and therefore a USP for us! Many media agencies have their origins in technical performance marketing, but don't give much thought to the real impact of the ads they play out ...

Fabian Habisreutinger ... because they are very focused on metrics such as cost-per-click or cost-per-order and neglect other components of successful communication. There are also the large network agencies, which are very well positioned internationally, but rarely find the "sweet spot" for medium-sized clients with a more local character. However, these clients are incredibly important if you want to grow anti-cyclically in a shrinking market. Not only do they deserve excellent support, but they also offer us as an agency enormous opportunities.

To be honest, it's been on our minds for a long time.

How does your consulting approach differ from that of the network agencies I just mentioned?

Katharina Günther The networks usually have separate units for social, TV or programmatic. These units often pursue their own interests; they have sales targets or other objectives that they have to be guided by. In many cases, this works more badly than well; these silos are no longer appropriate. We have never had them ... and they will not exist in the new structure of Sir Mary Media either. We only ask ourselves one thing: which measures will have the greatest impact on our customers' communication goals? We align everything we do with this.

FH I'm right there with Katharina. The media world is already highly fragmented, so we don't want to divide ourselves even further into silos as an agency. Instead, our clients have direct contacts who can provide them with strategic support - without an account manager having to act as an artificial intermediary. We closely interlink strategy and operations, similar to how art directors and copywriters collaborate in creation. We have strategists, planners and operations experts working together on solutions.

VH It is becoming increasingly important to look at where you can really achieve impact. You can't just put budget into programmatic because it seems to promise the best KPIs. We have to take the context and environment much more into account. Issues such as first party data, privacy and brand safety also come into play - we can no longer simply say: "'Spray and pray!' - we have the data; let's blow out what we can..." In the end, that's unsatisfactory for everyone ...

...because outside of the appropriate context, advertising that is played out acts more like an appendix to the overall communication than an integral part of it?

VH Exactly. How do we manage to achieve a holistic message in a fragmented media landscape with a wide variety of users? That's what frustrates customers ... you develop a strategy, create advertising media, and then they don't convert. Because the idea of a "big picture" is missing. We communicate this idea - and then we implement it.

However, this means that you have to work very closely with your customers' needs - and invest a lot of time in consulting. Can this effort be profitable at all?

FH We are convinced of this, otherwise we wouldn't do it. And we don't operate beyond economic criteria: For example, we work absolutely "platform agnostic" and are always direct to the source of inventory. Even if we - unlike various media market competitors - do not primarily buy for profit, we pay attention to the best gross/net margin for placements. And we set everything up "in-house", so we are efficiently organized.

Vanessa introduced the term brand safety: a hugely important topic for advertising clients. Curating environments according to impact is one thing - but how do you ensure that these environments are as safe as possible, especially for larger volumes?

FH This is of course a huge challenge. Users are increasingly using social media platforms that are gradually deconstructing their own control mechanisms. And traditional publishers, where people are still responsible for quality, are generating less and less reach. I don't currently have a perfect answer to the question of how we should deal with the fact that the biggest "hubs" for content are becoming less and less moderated ...

VH ... but it is all the more important to be aware of the problem. We are constantly checking what we can still do - sure, you can get third-party providers like Doubleverify or Integral Ad Science on board, but nobody can promise 100% security, that would be dubious. Especially as nobody knows how long Facebook or TikTok will allow their content to be checked by third-party providers.

Your plans are impressive. But do you really think you can counter the "PCI fetishism" that currently prevails?

FH If nobody initiates the debate and takes action, then nothing will change. We really need to look at the fundamental question - very critically, I mean - of what technical media KPIs such as visibility or CPMs mean. What is the "point" of X number of people seeing an ad if no one remembers it in the end? Nike, nota bene, almost buried its business by focusing purely on performance marketing - and had to switch back to brand building to great public fanfare. We want to spare our customers such maneuvers a priori. Cheap clicks are one thing, but real feedback from real people about where and how advertising is perceived is another. What we stand for is probably clear now.

If nobody initiates the debate and takes action, nothing will change.

Sir Mary is Became part of the Myty Group at the end of 2023. You have now transferred some of the employees to a new media structure. How have these changes affected the dynamics in the team?

FH Fortunately, very positively. We are now a team of around 20 people in the Media division. The focus is currently on Switzerland, but we are also looking after our first European clients. And here in Zurich, we have just moved into our own media space. Even though we work with Sir Mary on an integrated basis, media specialists have their own culture and need their own spaces.

KG Staff turnover is generally very, very low. Even against the background of the transformation you mentioned, we have had practically no departures, which is quite untypical for the agency sector. I think that speaks to the fact that we are doing a lot of things right in terms of team culture and setup - in other words, the close collaboration between planning and operations teams. Everyone is close to the task at hand, close to the customer ... that's how it should be.

VH This way of working also reflects our values. Positivity is one of them - we are positive about the challenges we face and are convinced that we can achieve the best results as a team. Media is often portrayed as a complex, inscrutable "monster topic". We want to break that down.

Cheap clicks are one thing, but real feedback from real people on where and how advertising is perceived is another.

What are your immediate goals?

FH We want to shape the next generation of media agencies. In other words, to combine cross-channel expertise with creative excellence and thus position ourselves as a genuine alternative to our established competitors.